Tap to unmute

House of the Dragon S1E04 live Q&A discussion

Share
Embed
  • Published on Sep 10, 2022
  • Discussing House of the Dragon Episode 4!
    This stream has no spoilers for House of the Dragon beyond S1E04. It does have spoilers for the original Game of Thrones show.
    Subscribe: x-vid.net/channel/UCveZ...
    Support on Patreon: www.patreon.com/AltShiftX
    Twitter: altshiftx
    Merch: standard.tv/altshiftx
    Alt Shift X Podcast: art19.com/shows/alt-shift-x-p...
    Podcast Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/77vubQG...
    Alt Shift X audio feed: anchor.fm/alt-shift-zzz
    Audio feed Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/23AwdUz...
    Discord: discord.gg/2CBtfNj
    Stream donations/questions: streamlabs.com/altshiftx
    Weekly livestreams every Sunday at ~10:15pm Eastern Time, right after each episode of HOTD.
    Then an Explained video later in the week, summarising and analysing each episode.

Comments • 1 510

  • Jack Brady
    Jack Brady 2 months ago +313

    After the brothel scene, Rhaenyra stopped wearing Daemon’s necklace too. Love all the meaning placed into little details :)

    • Rhianna Hayabusa
      Rhianna Hayabusa 2 months ago +3

      @Unfinished CGI Saying Daemon is a bad guy is showing how little you understand characters. Daemon is GRRMs fav character not because he's a typical black or white character like most characters from Disney+. He's a grey character, complicated, chaotic. He is human. Very flawed. It's unfortunate that many viewers are unable to comprehend it. I find it also disrespectful towards GRRM to classify such characters as just good or bad.

    • Elementroar
      Elementroar 2 months ago +3

      @jessieBird96 Well, he kinda makes it up to her big time but far into the future (in-universe time, not in show time cos we gonna get a shit ton of timeskips in the next few episodes).

    • Unfinished CGI
      Unfinished CGI 2 months ago +35

      @Pramod Bisht Yeah, it's almost like Daemon is a bad guy or something.

    • Pramod Bisht
      Pramod Bisht 2 months ago +9

      @jessieBird96 yea, that was really bad move by daemon how could he all hype her niece and then leave her half naked in the public.

    • jessieBird96
      jessieBird96 2 months ago +49

      For real, I don't expect her to forgive him any time soon, he got her drunk, seduced her, and then literally abandoned her with her pants down(assault/trauma?) This is a little different than the last time he slighted her so I don't think we'll see her in that necklace for a while.

  • 2ndcitysaint52
    2ndcitysaint52 2 months ago +1024

    the acting in this episode by viserys otto and allicent was so top tier, they really brought the complexity of the characters to life.

    • Juho Kiander
      Juho Kiander Month ago

      Æ

    • Donny Donowitz
      Donny Donowitz Month ago

      @andrew tate i i to w końcu powiedział mi nie pasuje mi nie h

    • Donny Donowitz
      Donny Donowitz Month ago

      @Max Chen
      u

      u


      u


      u


      u















      u





      u












      u


















































      i.

      UK nie jest tak jakby to

    • Everything Network
      Everything Network 2 months ago

      agreed

    • Maia Gaia
      Maia Gaia 2 months ago +2

      Yes! I feel Alicent's actress is a bit underated, but she's killing it! And of course Viserys and Otto are top notch

  • Haveldorf
    Haveldorf 2 months ago +1328

    Ser Criston looking mournfully at his white cloak as he put it down was really beautiful speechless storytelling.

    • 𝕃𝕠𝕝𝕝𝕚𝕡𝕠𝕡 𝕝𝕖𝕩𝕚
      𝕃𝕠𝕝𝕝𝕚𝕡𝕠𝕡 𝕝𝕖𝕩𝕚 2 months ago

      @abcd def would it not be difficult to have sex with armour on though?

    • Wendy C
      Wendy C 2 months ago

      @Haveldorf They are really doing a great job with the story telling without even saying a word.
      And the tension building is phenomenal

    • Tia Thompson
      Tia Thompson 2 months ago

      Yeahhhhhhh........Rhaenera was having her moment but it was selfish and impulsive. She did not consider the consequences for Sir Criston, or care about how it would affect him.

    • Everything Network
      Everything Network 2 months ago

      ikr

    • Emily Wilburn
      Emily Wilburn 2 months ago

      @Jayne Theory I like this read on things. And I think the scene can be empowering for Rhaenyra in terms of her sexual agency, which we rarely get to see girls get on screen, but also showing us how she handles power with more foreboding. Her actions themselves aren't exactly bad, but she takes them without thinking about the consequences, so even as it's exciting to see her taste freedom, at the same time it's worrying to see what she's doing with it.

  • Robin Foss
    Robin Foss 2 months ago +1417

    I haven't read Fire & Blood yet, but as soon as that kid stabbed that guy I had the thought that, years from now, songs will be sung of the two suitors who fought a duel for the hand of a princess.

    • George Harper
      George Harper 2 months ago

      😊😊😊😊😊

    • Kye Kimler
      Kye Kimler 2 months ago +1

      @Cancerino Pretty sure the Bracken and Blackwood feud goes way back to before the Targaryens, or even the Andals came to Westeros. That’s just straight out of the books.

    • Dillon Mooney
      Dillon Mooney 2 months ago

      @Bee D d bfgc

    • DespicableMi
      DespicableMi 2 months ago

      😅

    • B M
      B M 2 months ago

      @Lurklen salacious and pulpy? My guy tf we’re you reading?
      Sure there are sex scenes and debauchery here and there but it’s hardly the Kamasutra

  • EJR77
    EJR77 2 months ago +154

    Criston's post nut clarity must've been terrifying like "By the seven this girl gonna get my head chopped off"

    • Augustus Monroe
      Augustus Monroe 2 months ago +2

      Bruh, his pre-nut fog behavior offered him so many times to be like, "You know what...naw. I'm good. bye." he spent at least thirty minutes getting out his armor.

    • mmm k
      mmm k 2 months ago +2

      kenjataimu

    • TOLSTOI
      TOLSTOI 2 months ago

      He should be more worried about this child who is about to get murdered

    • Joe Parrigen
      Joe Parrigen 2 months ago +2

      Lol 😆 😆

  • Peanutcat
    Peanutcat 2 months ago +212

    The blackwood boy in the opening scene was just unreal. His acting was incredibly good

    • Dede Zeinabou Tounkara
      Dede Zeinabou Tounkara 2 months ago

      @Kye Kimler op

    • Kye Kimler
      Kye Kimler 2 months ago +1

      You’ll see more of him, since if I’m not mistaken that’s Bloody Ben Blackwood who has a pretty huge role in the books along with his Mum :)
      Edit: it could also be his dad Samwell, who in the books also fights a duel against a Bracken but loses (doesn’t die however). They might be conflating the two characters for the show however, since Bloody Ben would technically be way younger at this time in the books.
      2nd Edit: I wrote this before ASX started talking about it lmao

    • hillbillypowpow
      hillbillypowpow 2 months ago +3

      @Spamquisition yeah if the scene was half a second longer he'd have been spewing all over the floor of Storm's End

    • Spamquisition
      Spamquisition 2 months ago +11

      I love how he panicked and started gagging as the scene cuts. Really sold how his adrenaline is drying up and the full weight of him killing another man (as a boy too!) slammed down on to him.

  • Nathan Mitchell
    Nathan Mitchell 2 months ago +230

    This episode was peak season 1-4 Game of Thrones. No flashy action or giant battles, just the characters, the setting, the politics, and the return of good writing.

    • House of Matrix
      House of Matrix 2 months ago

      I definitely agree

    • Malek
      Malek 2 months ago

      @TheInfectous to add to this, D&D were shitty writers from the start. Even in seasons 1-4 most of their original ideas were pretty bad. Not to mention that they did a pretty lackluster job on actually adapting a large amount of the characters and storylines properly even from the published books.

    • Alec Nazari
      Alec Nazari 2 months ago

      You are goddamn right

    • Brett Adkins
      Brett Adkins 2 months ago +1

      Yeah, I don't think the dialogue is near as good as the original dragon show.

    • CC 07
      CC 07 2 months ago

      The only thing missing for GoT S1-4 levels is the amazing dialogue

  • El Mooo
    El Mooo 2 months ago +323

    The most violent thing on this series was when Viserys just slid off Otto's badge
    Just brutal

    • A B
      A B 2 months ago

      😂😂😂

    • Cyanda Madlala
      Cyanda Madlala 2 months ago

      @El Mooo otto doesn't have the wit or brutaliy to be compared to tywin.

    • El Mooo
      El Mooo 2 months ago +7

      @A Man chooses, a Slave obeys
      Now that Otto isn't obligated to Viserys he'll get up to some Tywin level shit with Daemon and Rhaenyra

    • A Man chooses, a Slave obeys
      A Man chooses, a Slave obeys 2 months ago +28

      It was worse than taking his head lol
      His whole life was being The Hand. He lost his only relevance. And Viserys got a really powerfull enemy.

    • Concept
      Concept 2 months ago +6

      *So far

  • Lurklen
    Lurklen 2 months ago +787

    I feel like Daemon's issue was that he actually cared about her all of a sudden, and knowing that this whole thing was a manipulation (because clearly he was attempting to publicly tarnish her image and then leave himself as the only possible suiter. Dude hates his wife, and she's access to the throne), he suddenly couldn't go through with it. The real benefit for for Rhaenrya was the discovery that, y'know, people don't just have sex because it results in kids or they have to (the fact that he sexual awakening is connected her uncle is messed up obviously), but as bad as it was for her politically, it seems that it might have been good for her well being to realize there are things beyond the birthing bed in her future.
    There is a hilarious irony in everyone being aghast at Raenrya faffing about with her uncle, when not a year ago Otto was presenting marriage to her 3 year old brother as a valid political move. It's fine if they put her into an incestuous union, but if she does it for herself its disgusting (I know it's a bit more about Daemon taking advantage, but even so there's an element, certainly from Alicent that what makes it disgusting is it being her idea).
    Also, the consent vibes with Criston and Raenrya are actually stronger the other way around. Criston is in a vulnerable position in that scene. Her future might be damaged if they were caught, but she's still a princess, he might have been executed (still could be). How would he really be able to pull off saying no if he'd wanted to. She's likely the future Queen, she's his boss, though she's younger she holds all the cards. (That said, I think he was holding himself back until his armour was off, once the weight of his duty was shucked, he could ignore it and listen to his desires.)

    • Lurklen
      Lurklen 2 months ago

      @CC 07 Incest is common for Targaryns, but everyone except the Targaryns doesn't like that. For a very long time there's nothing they can do about that, but it doesn't mean it's not something the rest of the realm is disgusted by. This comes up many times in the books, and Alicent even comments on it this episode. "You Targayens have strange customs." It's part of her accusation against Rhaenyra.

    • Carolina Lucio
      Carolina Lucio 2 months ago

      @MistressDistress both can be true: her messing w/ her uncle and her having premarital sex. Doing it in public tho doesn’t seem like an issue to the everyday commoner, it’s more the fact that the princess of all people is out here doing that. So it’s less about public indecency and more of her being of a high social status. Either way Rhynera still digging herself deeper into a whole for staining her reputation

    • MistressDistress
      MistressDistress 2 months ago +1

      It’s not about her messing around with her uncle. It’s about her messing around before marriage. Or more specifically, doing so in public. While being a woman.

    • CC 07
      CC 07 2 months ago +1

      @Lurklen Again no. Obviously they care its unmarried sex because she is female. But nothing else really bothers them much. Incest is common. So is adultery. Just not for women.

    • Lurklen
      Lurklen 2 months ago

      @CC 07 Depends on who we're talking about. Also, even more than caring that she isn't married, they care that it was public and she's female. But there's a lot of people in Westeros at that time who are not really down with the Targ nonsense, and as Daemon says, the views of the common people matter if you plan to rule them.

  • Mindstate
    Mindstate 2 months ago +347

    I think fans need to realize its not going to be "dragons fire" every episode. The original first few seasons of game of thrones were not full of action, but once D&D turned the show to shit, it just became a marvel movie. I embrace the normal drama without action. These actors are very good and are intriguing and carrying the show without any action.

    • Brittney Streeter
      Brittney Streeter 2 months ago +11

      @Peter D I’ve seen dozens of comments through multiple videos of people saying “this is boring” “there weren’t even any dragons” “where are the battles”. Sadly it seems most people have the attention span of gnats and brains about the same size. I like the battles and the dragons, but I want a story! I want interesting dialogue and character development. Game of thrones gave us some pretty cool battles and dragon scenes the last few seasons, but everything else sucked. I’ll take a good story over CGI any day.

    • Ezra Faith
      Ezra Faith 2 months ago +3

      @-MR-PoPo- ur cringe

    • AVerySillySausage
      AVerySillySausage 2 months ago +1

      And the action will be so much more of a payoff after all this build up.

    • Peter D
      Peter D 2 months ago +30

      Are fans even complaining though ? The fact that the earlier seasons of got was more popular than later seasons demonstrates how much fans value good dialogue and story telling over flashes and bangs

    • CallMeCalvin
      CallMeCalvin 2 months ago

      ...this isn't that. It's incest.

  • Silvia
    Silvia 2 months ago +101

    Personally, I find that not showing off the dragons all the time in every episode gives more of a badass look to the family, because now it just comes off so casual. Like "Oh btw, we also have a couple of dragons but whatever"

    • Autumn Haywood
      Autumn Haywood 2 months ago

      They're like that in the books! They don't whip out the dragons at every moment/turn. They mostly use soldiers, diplomacy, etc. Jahearys (spelling?) said that the dragon threat was best when veiled or unseen ... Something to that effect. I liked that a lot, and am glad they kept that so in the show so far. Makes them more relatable. Which of course, is the point.

    • Se7en
      Se7en  2 months ago +2

      agreed

  • Jai Authenti
    Jai Authenti 2 months ago +443

    As a book reader, this was the best episode to me. Completely took this mysterious part of the story and made it better. I loved how Rhaenyra is finally showing cracks in her armor. From victimized teen to an adult dealing with the results of her actions. This episode finally gave me that old thrones feeling back.

    • TheKingOfRooks
      TheKingOfRooks 2 months ago

      @Greywolf757 I honestly really like the idea that the Velaryons, and maybe just lower class Valyrians in general, were dark skinned peoples and it just naturally was bred out as the only matches made were with white Westerosi people. Besides, George is heavily involved and he retcons shit all the time it doesn't really matter what they change.

    • Roronoa Law
      Roronoa Law 2 months ago +4

      @Greywolf757 Corlys having dark skin changes nothing from the plot

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago +1

      @Roronoa Law The book mentioned several possibilities, showing that it was just an estimate on what happened from incomplete sources. That's why it is easier to accept small changes to the plot. Bigger changes, like Corlys being black, would not have slipped past the historians however.

    • TheOne
      TheOne 2 months ago +1

      Very true. At first I felt deprived of any action but this really does fill in many holes from fire and blood. Had to watch it 2-3 times to truly appreciate it.

    • Roronoa Law
      Roronoa Law 2 months ago

      @KingEdwardMMVIII I know, I’ve read it

  • Mindstate
    Mindstate 2 months ago +551

    This episode hooked me in. Im attached to all the characters now. Even Otto, who I didnt like prior.

    • TheKingOfRooks
      TheKingOfRooks 2 months ago

      @Cyrus Smith yeah he's kind of a more Littlefinger version of the character than the shows Littlefinger. They made Baelish, like you said, kinda stand out in the show way more than he should. In the books he's unassuming, he's hardly ever even thought of by other characters much less mentioned and it's unclear if people even know how much of a schemer he is or that he is one at all. Varys is the spider lurking in the garden that everyone is afraid of meanwhile Petyr Baelish is just, well, Littlefinger.

    • A Man chooses, a Slave obeys
      A Man chooses, a Slave obeys 2 months ago

      @bobjoemac1 True Neutral

    • bobjoemac1
      bobjoemac1 2 months ago +1

      @David M it's more the fact that he might only ever report bad stuff about people/political rivals he doesn't like instead of a totally neutral opinion. Doubt he was reporting anything bad about himself and Alicent to the king etc.

    • Christina Catalano
      Christina Catalano 2 months ago

      Same same same

    • Queen B
      Queen B 2 months ago +1

      @Dave Dogge I will never understand why anyone is worried about the older actors as if they would purposely miscast anyone. If the younger cast is perfect, the older ones have to be even more perfect because that's when the real story starts

  • Jayne Theory
    Jayne Theory 2 months ago +31

    I think when people were talking about "consent," they were referencing Cole's - not Rhaenyra's, due to the imbalance of power and his inability to say no to her even knowing that it could cost him his life.

    • OkayTurtle
      OkayTurtle 2 months ago

      @Robyn Hyden he literally protested by telling her to “stop” and she still wouldn’t let him leave. Super rapey

    • Robyn Hyden
      Robyn Hyden 2 months ago +8

      Yes, exactly. He looked super uncomfortable. She literally blocked the door and wouldn’t let him leave!

  • Spearshake
    Spearshake 2 months ago +280

    Otto genuinely seemed disturbed by the rumors sent to him. Its interesting that when word reached him no smile was borne on his face as one would think because his grandson would stand a chance to be named heir because of it. The show is really starting to show us how every character drove each other into their respective directions and maybe this was the straw that broke the camel's back. Otto was not really ambitious from the start, Jaeherys chose him simply because he was one of many present in his court and he rose to that duty asked of him by his king.

    • Emily Wilburn
      Emily Wilburn 2 months ago +1

      @It not me It u I think I haven't trusted Otto since he told Alicent to wear one of her mother's dresses to visit Viserys. But I also think that having a family to take care of automatically gives him more understandable motives than Littlefinger. I don't think the book will be able to say if Otto is working more for himself or for the realm lol

    • Cykasoviet
      Cykasoviet 2 months ago +1

      @Notdeadyet That point would strengthen the argument though, as he told the king despite knowing of the consequences. He knew Viserys would assume he's spreading rumors for political gain, but he told him anyway because it was his duty & he was still loyal to the king, even if he did have his own ambitions

    • Gus
      Gus 2 months ago +2

      @It not me It u The book gives multiple suggestions as to what kind of people everyone was. To me, the Otto we see in the show isn't a bad guy. He wants to solidify his house's place in court, but also wants what's best for the realm. It's not too different from Corlys and Rhaenys wanting more power from a Laena/Viserys marriage.

    • Breakfastbean
      Breakfastbean 2 months ago +5

      According to the post-episode explanation, the showrunners said that Otto felt an advantage in telling the king, but he was also afraid of being the one to tell Viserys as well because he still cared about him.

    • Jamie_ D0G
      Jamie_ D0G 2 months ago

      @It not me It u He is always kind of reluctant about many of his political moves, he is far from being Littlefinger

  • Evan Nesbitt
    Evan Nesbitt 2 months ago +378

    Did anyone else love how Ser Harold Westerling was so gangster in this episode? "King Viserys demands an audience with you, my Prince" as Daemon is getting manhandled by two of his comrades

    • TheKingOfRooks
      TheKingOfRooks 2 months ago +1

      Ser Harold is my favorite ancillary character in the show by far

    • Pramod Bisht
      Pramod Bisht 2 months ago

      Where? What gangster? I just watched the show and i already forgotten most part of it.

    • Sit-ins For sithis
      Sit-ins For sithis 2 months ago

      Hé is gonna eat his words

    • Praetorian 61
      Praetorian 61 2 months ago

      Daemon will cut him into pieces soon tho

    • Vikaash Baynath
      Vikaash Baynath 2 months ago +5

      He reminds me of Ser Davos

  • mmm k
    mmm k 2 months ago +97

    otto's stunned 'your grace' during his audience with viserys was so perfect like i really believed him you know

    • mmm k
      mmm k 2 months ago +2

      @Lunar Light yes all the actors are doing a great job so far 👏👏

    • Lunar Light
      Lunar Light 2 months ago +1

      IKR! I noticed it too, absolutely amazing voice acting.

  • Ian Michel
    Ian Michel 2 months ago +397

    I’m pretty sure Daemon wanted Rhaenyra and himself to be seen to give Viserys a reason to wed them to save face. After all he took off both his hood and her hat as they entered the brothel

    • trapd00rspider
      trapd00rspider 2 months ago +3

      His mistress did suggest bringing someone in with silver hair when he had performance anxiety in an earlier episode.

    • Revolution 2020
      Revolution 2020 2 months ago

      @merkikima Def. possible

    • merkikima
      merkikima 2 months ago

      @Revolution 2020 if his intentions were to help her then why have sexe with her in a public place? Makes no sense deamon absolutly wanted them to be seen for obvious reasons and couldn't go through with it

    • Ian Michel
      Ian Michel 2 months ago +2

      @Revolution 2020 I also agree with that actually, I think it was multi-layered intentions. Both from his heart and head so to speak

    • Revolution 2020
      Revolution 2020 2 months ago +4

      I disagree that Daemon seduced Rhaenyra to use her as revenge against his brother or just as a power grab. I think he genuinely meant what he said to Viserys, that he would be better being her first experience than all of these old crusty lords that only wanted her for her bloodline and dragons. I think that by showing her she can enjoy and empower herself even if married, Daemon thought that he was helping by motivating her to hurry up and just go through with picking and marrying someone, thus ending the delays and Viserys' frustration. I also think that it popped into his head later, "hey, what if I just married her instead?" and brought it up to his brother because he sees it as a show of Targaryen strength against the forces that he knows have been rallying around waiting on Viserys to weaken or die off. Two adult Targaryens married to each other are infinitely more powerful than a vassal family, the HIghtowers, trying to secure the throne for a two-year-old. Despite the way Daemon misreads Viserys and acts impulsively, I think his motivations are to solve the problems as he sees them and help his family.

  • FrostyBD
    FrostyBD 2 months ago +89

    I rewatched the ep and I think Daemon genuinely cares for Rhaenyra and one of the reason he doesn’t go through with it (plus the lack of control he felt stated in the inside the episode) is because he felt guilty. Take out that brothel scene and his fight with Viserys and he genuinely looks like he is homesick and missed his family. The convo with Rhaenyra in the godswood showed he genuinely cared for her well-being and was looking out for her and her happiness it felt so genuinely and real I don’t think it was a ploy. Also during the adventure in kings landing it genuinely felt like he was preparing her for rule making her aware of the people thoughts and the threat Aegon naturally has to her. Even tho there is definitely a plot for power and to marry her thinking about it more Rhaenyra wins the most by marrying Daemon. Not only is her succession further secured by marrying a male potential heir she also get the added boost of Daemons increased popularity after the stepstones and his prestige as a warrior something Aegon doesn’t have. Yes Daemon went about it a slimy way but thinking about it, it was the only way to potentially force Viserys into agreeing. Plus I think it’s very telling that after he stopped we see him shitfaced drunk like he drown himself in alcohol due to guilt. It also further goes with that Characterisation that Daemon puts his family Viserys and Rhaenyra above all else.

    • Simone V
      Simone V 2 months ago

      @FrostyBD OR because he wanted to be there with HER. I think it’s more likely it’s your scenario, but I just want to put it out there that he was offered a white haired maiden to fuck in that very brothel the very first episode. Maybe he has a (naive) vision of the brothel as his secret garden, where what happens there stays there and no intention of her ever being seen outside of there. Remember - Otto may very well not have heard anything from anyone inside the building, since he gave false information about them having intercourse. It could just be his interpretation of her running out of the building.
      Speculation of course, but isn’t that the name os this game we’re playing? Haha

    • Monke
      Monke 2 months ago

      Guys thanks, I understood : )

    • FrostyBD
      FrostyBD 2 months ago +3

      @Monke because he wanted him and her to be recognised and discovered. It was all part of his plan he wanted to use the scandal to force Viserys into allowing her to marry him so they can “restore the house of the dragon”.

    • Surmatic
      Surmatic 2 months ago +1

      @Monke because it's both he loves Rhaenyra and lust for the throne.

    • Monke
      Monke 2 months ago

      But why did daemon remove Rhaenyra's head scarf before entering the brothel if he really cares?

  • AnimatedMonkey
    AnimatedMonkey 2 months ago +214

    this episode really made me love rhanyrea, im really gonna miss her actress after the time jump.

    • Ntr54
      Ntr54 2 months ago

      @coxmanbgg just call her rhaenussy

    • Gus
      Gus 2 months ago +1

      @Miguel Marques very necessary

    • Pramod Bisht
      Pramod Bisht 2 months ago

      She was looking so pretty in orange dress, but after the episode i won't see her like before:(

    • SD Pearshaped
      SD Pearshaped 2 months ago +3

      @Miguel Marques originally the older actors were cast and then later they cast the younger actors on their likeness. The main story is going to be seasons 2 and 3.

    • Adriel U
      Adriel U 2 months ago +3

      @Miguel Marques the kids of Rhaenyra and alicent play a big part in the actual dance so they have to be older in order to actually do things. Also the ten year skip is just more tension and nothing happening

  • Alex Boatman
    Alex Boatman 2 months ago +225

    Most likely the color in Seasmoke's wings is from subsurface scattering in the membrane. Like when you put a flashlight behind your fingertips they appear red because of the blood in your body. With Seasmoke being so light in color it would be more noticeable than on other dragons and make the wings appear more pink.

    • Alex Holslin
      Alex Holslin 2 months ago +1

      @YeahYeah people want their cgi shit to look real, it's not that complicated

    • YeahYeah
      YeahYeah 2 months ago

      @Alex Holslin it's a cgi dragon. Not real. Pretend, make belief.

    • Chris T
      Chris T 2 months ago

      @tom soyer literally watch just one corridor crew video and you'd see how much this stuff matters

    • Alex Boatman
      Alex Boatman 2 months ago +5

      @tom soyer Your point? We apply subsurface scattering in cg materials to make skin look realistic (because skin ins translucent) and less like plastic. It's one of those things audiences don't think about because your brain believes it when it's there, but when it's not then "something is off" and people don't exactly know why.
      Thanos was just a "cgi dude" but he had subsurface scattering and they even made his pores stretch with his facial expressions like real skin does.

    • tom soyer
      tom soyer 2 months ago

      It's a cgi dragon dude

  • Emma Capaldi
    Emma Capaldi 2 months ago +53

    I thought that the Maester giving her the tea was also sort of a catch-22 for her, she’s maybe left thinking “take the tea and prove you’re not a virgin by drinking it or don’t drink the tea and potentially become pregnant”
    I think the episode being directed by a woman made it so interesting by showing the intrigue, mild confusion, discomfort, and excitement of a young woman’s sexual awakening. Rhaenyra wouldn’t have known Daemon couldn’t get hard, she was just confused & abandoned (and left wanting).
    The thing that threw me off was the scarring on Matt Smith’s neck. Couldn’t tell if it was meant to be greyscale at first.

    • Emma Capaldi
      Emma Capaldi 2 months ago +4

      @Greywolf757 Sure he could, but don’t you think people generally have more insight to their own experience/mind than someone else can? Like if you lived through something that I didn’t, I would think you could tell the story better than I could lol

    • Pramod Bisht
      Pramod Bisht 2 months ago

      @tempodude have a nice day 👍

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago +1

      A male director can show the intrigue, mild confusion, discomfort, and excitement of a young woman's sexual awakening. Why do you think that directors can only direct their own gender?

    • Konrad von Schnitzeldorf
      Konrad von Schnitzeldorf 2 months ago +1

      @tempodude now i agree with you to an extend, the Sigma guy is pretty cringe and being too nitpicky won't make your live better. On the other hand, the casuals in twitter and tiktok will overhype anything with no regards. They also hyped the shitty GoT seasons after S6 and only understood how bad it got at the last Episode.

    • tempodude
      tempodude 2 months ago +8

      @Pramod Bisht damn independant free thinking sugma im shaking rn
      hating popular shit doesnt make you more of anything, you're just missing out

  • Keaton Parsons
    Keaton Parsons 2 months ago +36

    I feel like Rhaenyra only wants to be queen because people keep telling her that she can't. She mentioned once that she would reform things once she was queen, which adds a little depth to her desire to be queen. But other than that everything we've seen indicates that she has no real interest in politics or appeasing lords or ruling the realm or even having children, which is vital to kingdom stability (as we've already seen). She also said that she wants to live in solitude? A queen can't live in solitude. It seems like she just wants to be free of all the expectations, and if that's what she wants she should have been begging her father to disinherit her. I guess she thinks becoming queen will absolve her of her insecurities and prove that she is "worthy," but we all know that's not true. The title of queen is just a mantle. It doesn't change you or what people think about you. Interesting character, but not one I'm rooting for (to be fair, not really rooting for anyone at this point).
    Edit: Actually I may root for Corlys Valarian. He seems pretty cool so far. His wife also seems like perhaps she would have been a good queen, so they really are the house that got shafted.

    • Joshua Perry
      Joshua Perry 2 months ago

      Their son was shafted. Her claim is fabricated by show

    • Gus
      Gus 2 months ago +3

      She's very much being an unreasonable teenager lol

  • Rene Bara
    Rene Bara 2 months ago +274

    Criston Cole removing the closk really reminded me of the Soiled Knight chapter and I think I still saw a lot of hesitation on his part.
    Also a problem with the Rhaegar Catspaw dagger theory is that I feel like Robert would never shut up about having Rhaegar’s special Valyrian steel knife

    • Himanshu Pawar
      Himanshu Pawar 2 months ago +1

      @ThornInTheEye yeah, also, very few people can read valerian

    • ThornInTheEye
      ThornInTheEye 2 months ago +2

      @Himanshu Pawar even if someone heated it up it wouldn't really tell much to anyone. Priests of R'Hlorr say pretty much the same thing and no one really cares

    • Himanshu Pawar
      Himanshu Pawar 2 months ago

      The thing about the Prophecy on the Dagger was that it cannot be seen until it's heated. Proves why nobody read it in GOT.

    • Carlton
      Carlton 2 months ago +10

      I think the great part about the cloak was everything else was getting dropped to the ground with no regard but he makes sure that it doesn’t fall and somewhat folds it and puts it up. The symbolism of how much it meant to him after saying it was the greatest honor in his house’s history was cool

    • ThornInTheEye
      ThornInTheEye 2 months ago +8

      By the time of Robert I doubt anyone even knew that the dagger belonged to Aegon. They'll probably tie it in as being lost during the Danse

  • Clayton Schopfer
    Clayton Schopfer 2 months ago +121

    I think Allicent is angry with her because she knows that if it is true it is an incredibly stupid decision which could get her into a tone of trouble. Maybe even physical danger and she actually does care for her as a friend

    • KMK
      KMK 2 months ago +1

      @Yellow House Yeah, that’s true too! Complex emotions…

    • Yellow House
      Yellow House 2 months ago +23

      I think she's also just a bit jealous. She said in the beginning of the episode that Rhaenyra should consider herself lucky for having so many suitors as most women, even noble born, don't even get to decide between two. Alicent was already so hesitant and disgusted when she was woken up to meet the king and she obviously hates having sex with him, for her it's just a duty and a facade she has to put up. So hearing that her former best friend can just go out, fuck for fun and not really have any consequences because she's royal problably made her incredibly angry and bitter. Cause in the end, as long as Viserys doesn't disinherit her, no one would pass up the chance to marry Rhaenyra, even Iif she was "soiled"

    • KMK
      KMK 2 months ago +16

      @Cruz L I feel like you’ve hit the nail on the head with that observation. Maybe Alicent just wants Rhaenyra to be free, which inadvertently causes the rift…

    • Cruz L
      Cruz L 2 months ago +37

      I think it's highly possible that allicent will turn into a character that thinks she is doing what's best for everyone. In the sense that I can see her thinking if aegon takes the crown then rhaenyra can get the freedom she has always wanted.

  • Voxitude
    Voxitude 2 months ago +45

    I really do feel that you’re overestimating how much power Christon Cole had in that situation. Rhaenyra is both the princess and the Heir to the throne. Everything Christon Cole has is due to Rhaenyra.
    While there is certainly chemistry between the two, it’s very clear he wasn’t a willing participant at first. He seemed quite resigned and recognized that if the princess wanted this, he really didn’t have the authority to say no, even if it’s the worst decision possible.
    I don’t think it’s as simple as “Rhaenyra is a teenager, Christon should know better and walk away.” When Rhaenyra holds so much power over him. He seemed resigned to his fate.

    • Chris Connor
      Chris Connor 2 months ago +1

      He knows Rhaenyra wouldnt dismiss him from the Kingsguard or concoct some plan against him for standing his ground. He slept with her because he wanted to

    • A Jae
      A Jae 2 months ago

      @cactusmilk There was far more danger in him being discovered fucking the princess or having it known than in him saying no and not doing it. He chose to have sex. He was very proactive during the act. He put emotional distance between them the next day making clear that he had decided not to do it again, and she did not demand more or punish him. She let it go as she would have if he had walked out the night before. He chose to stay because he wanted to fuck. You are trying to apply feminist theory of sexual power imbalance to make a point but only proving that you don't understand it. He is a fully empowered knight with all the laws of the land on his side and understands that she would suffer tremendously news of their session got out. Yes princess but still a woman. Let him be a cook or mason, and you might have a point.

    • cactusmilk
      cactusmilk 2 months ago +7

      @A Jae he did say no. he said stop, which IS the same thing. he didnt kiss her back the first once or twice she kissed him. he couldnt even look her in the eye, he was standing perfectly still. if this scene was shot with the sexes reversed it would come across as more clearly unfortunately to people. it took him a long time to start undressing himself, after, again, he had already said stop.

    • A Jae
      A Jae 2 months ago +1

      He could have said no. The worst possible consequence of saying no had Rhaenyra lost her mind and not understood why he would refuse and go to bed alone would have been to be reassigned to a lesser position. But as Rhaenyra is not a selfish lunatic at this point, there is no reason to believe that had he refused with a clear explanation of his duties she would have forced herself (raped) on him.. And Viserys would have investigated any story she would have made up to punish him. Being a woman Rhaenyra would be under suspicion for the rest of her life if Criston had to be reassigjed. He broke his vow by his own terrible choice. It's not as if he's some maid-servant with no personal or political power whatsoever.
      After the sex he seemed to put more distance between them. She could just as easily punish him for that as she could have for refusing him. She seemed to accept his choice as she would have the night before.

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago +6

      Yeah, if a prince coerced a servant girl ten years older than him to have sex with him, I don't think people would criticize the servant girl. Yet suddenly with the genders reversed, Cole is treated as responsible.

  • Sarah Hall
    Sarah Hall 2 months ago +118

    I think it was Daemon’s plan to get caught. He wants power and he can be king through Rhaenyra. He wants to marry her but he knows his brother would never allow it. So he had to soil her reputation to wed her because no one else would want her now, so Viserys would have to allow it. I think Mysaria was in on the plan as well, but not as a willful participant.

    • Olorin
      Olorin 2 months ago

      @Alt Shift X I dunno, being so public assured it would be noticed by many. Otto also implies that Mysaria has been an informer of his for a while. I think Mysaria wants revenge on Daemon for gambling with her life.

    • trapd00rspider
      trapd00rspider 2 months ago

      Mysaria did seem to know that Daemon would be into someone with silver hair that previous time. I keep wanting to know what that was about. Had he talked to her previously about wanting to create a pure bloodline or something?

    • mejuliie
      mejuliie 2 months ago

      To me it seemed like he was showing her the "real world", at first. Until the brothel where he made a point to take off her beanie, so that people would recognize her. Don't think his plan was for Mysaria to tell it to Otto, as he clearly didn't expect to be restrained by the guards when he got back to the Red Keep.
      He meant for people to see her and force Visery's to marry her to him. Just thought it would come as a rumor from the people, instead of from a spy to Otto.
      Also Mysaria seemed like she wanted to tell Daemon something, but decided not to in the end. Pretty sure that she didn't tell him, she had sent a messenger to Otto.

    • Max Smith
      Max Smith 2 months ago

      Big agree, except I think he isn't gunning for a marriage with Rhaenyra. I think his target was her reputation, with the end goal of making him the most obvious choice as heir. The lords and small folk alike will hate Rhaenyra now, but Daemon won't suffer any consequences for their night on the town.

    • che498
      che498 2 months ago +5

      @Alt Shift X I definitely think Daemon wanted to be recognized but I don’t know that he was in cahoots with Mysaria. When he awoke, it sounded like they hadn’t spoken in ages and it appeared he was completely unaware of her change in profession, as she had to tell him she was no longer in the business of exchanging sexual favors for coin.
      I think Daemon simply knew that it would get out based on previous experience… in terms of how the “heir for a day” quote - in that same brothel I assume -, spread and reached Viserys. This brings into question, however, how long Mysaria and Otto have had a business relationship and whether she was responsible for that quote making its way to the ear of the Hand.

  • KK
    KK 2 months ago +43

    When I read the novellas, it was obvious to me the Ser Criston did not reject Rhaenyra. His subsequent rather extreme actions were not of someone offended, but of someone who is deeply hurt and betrayed.

    • KK
      KK 2 months ago +1

      @Robyn HydenYou should listen to the actor who played Ser Cristoon in the official podcast.

    • Robyn Hyden
      Robyn Hyden 2 months ago +1

      I think you could read the scene as though he was coerced into having sex with her. She has all the power in the situation. He could be ashamed and hurt that he was unable to say no, but didn’t want to consent.

    • KK
      KK 2 months ago +6

      @Yellow House I expect whatever betrayal Ser Criston suffers will happen much later in the story. I expect it will have something to do with Rhaenyra's second marriage. But I agree that the fact he broke his oath for her will compound his pain.

    • Yellow House
      Yellow House 2 months ago +10

      Yeah same, I really thought they would spell out the reason why he turns on her eventually in this episode. Personally I think that he hears these rumours about Daemon and Rhaenyra, she tells him that they didn't actually fuck and that Daemon left her, he realises he was only a "back up" und that he broke his oath and honor on her whim and feels so betrayed and disappointed that he turns on her. We'll see

  • Madison Houchin
    Madison Houchin 2 months ago +44

    Christan clearly felt uncomfortable and hesitant and seemed to not fully have a choice, the power dynamic made it so it’s not really on him. It’s also hard to put blame on rhaenyra because she’s a young girl that doesn’t really fully grasp the power dynamics and that he couldn’t easily say no to her

    • P G
      P G 2 months ago

      @Chris T Daemon did not molest her. Come on, that was completely consensual, she was even more into it than him and being rejected caused her to take what she wanted from Cole instead.

    • Elessar0wind
      Elessar0wind 2 months ago

      Doesn't matter who's actually to blame, what matters is the consequences. If what they did gets out, both their reputations will be ruined, and their lives cut short. Cristen will no doubt be beheaded for treason and breaking his oaths, and Rhaenyra will truly lose all her freedoms, likely never marry, and be called a whore behind her back for the rest of her life. They'll both be punished by their society.

    • Chris T
      Chris T 2 months ago +15

      @Greywolf757 sure but if that young prince had minutes previously been molested by an older family member you could assume they're experiencing some sexual confusion that might lead them to making such a bad decision as coercing a servant. It's possible for them both to be victims

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago +5

      If it were a boy Rhaenryra's age (likely around 17 at this point) and he pressured a serving woman ten years older than him to have sex with him, I think most people would see the serving woman as the victim. I don't think many people would think that he was too young at 17 to understand what he was doing.

  • Theodore
    Theodore 2 months ago +71

    I think you missed one thing though: Daemon is using the white worm's spies to his own benefit, the whole point was to orchestrate this outing so that then he can say to Viserys "Welp she's already spoiled, might as well give her (and the throne) to me" - this whole thing was orchestrated by Daemon

    • Oscar Evans
      Oscar Evans 2 months ago +2

      He's clearly been out of contact with mysaria for a while, since he's been in the stepstones. He seemed to resent her intervening, and her taking over a portion of the the brothels and underworld of kings landing is clearly something he was not aware of.

    • Hoked
      Hoked 2 months ago +2

      @Max Smith Marrying her would've been the cleanest way to the throne for Daemon. I'm fairly sure he backed out because he felt bad about it.

    • Max Smith
      Max Smith 2 months ago +2

      That's a cool idea, that Daemon paid off the spies.
      One other thing is that I think Daemon isn't really in it to marry Rhaenyra, but to tarnish her reputation. Daemon won the moment she entered the pleasure house with him--it doesn't matter if they banged or not, as long as the rumors of incest ruined her bid for the throne and marriage to a powerful family.

    • Simone V
      Simone V 2 months ago

      Ooo that’s a cool idea 👀

  • Theodore
    Theodore 2 months ago +25

    I really loved this episode and I think they're getting back to the great political intrigue that really made GoT so special. It was never about tits and dragons, it was about the political implications behind tits and dragons.

  • Samantha Shugars
    Samantha Shugars 2 months ago +28

    I think part of it is that Alicent is trapped but I also think she’s genuinely concerned about her friend. She sees Raenyra is being childish and making decisions that could endanger her. I think she is worried as much as angry or jealous.

  • Matt
    Matt 2 months ago +26

    This was actually my favorite episode so far, I thought the cadence of the writing and directing was better than the previous ones which was the only thing throwing me a bit off from comparing it to game of thrones. My only complaint is that it seemed a bit drastic and out of nowhere for viserys to remove Otto as hand. The episodes prior viserys seemed to see him as incredibly loyal, seemed a bit steep to get rid of him so quickly.

    • Sean Potts
      Sean Potts 2 months ago +3

      I think the important difference is on top of being told about rhaenyra and daemon from Otto, he realizes finally that Otto planted Alicent so they might get married. It was the double combo that made him fully question his loyalty

  • EK X
    EK X 2 months ago +46

    I only now realise how forbidden love is a such a classic human trope that it made its way into own systems and laws. It's easy to be tempted by power, and it's easy to maniuplate. And sometimes love is love and the rules are against both parties being happy together. Criston's actor was great at showing the inner turmoil at the beginning, the moment he lets go, and then the shame and uncomfortable look after the fact. The undressing scene was incredibly hot tho. I understand now the appeal and the success of Mills & Boons books.

  • Notribad's vault
    Notribad's vault 2 months ago +30

    25:50 the way the fight happened felt very natural compared to the violence at the tournament. Blackwood was literally gagging after he stabbed Bracken, showing that he didn’t actually want to kill him. The way everyone reacted made it clear it wasn’t normal.

  • Daniel Burgess
    Daniel Burgess 2 months ago +75

    Otto was scheming yes, but he’s nothing alike to Littlefinger and such. Ultimately he does not want to create chaos for his own gain, he would still rather the realm thrive than thrive himself at the expense of everything around him. At least I think.

    • A Jae
      A Jae 2 months ago +1

      You're being too literal about the comparison. He doesn't have to use Petyr's exact methods to have similar outcomes. Being a Hightower throwing the realm into chaos wouldn't serve his interests. But he most certainly takes advantage of chaotic situations for the benefit of himself and his house.
      He saw Aemma's death, Viserys's grief, and the concern over lack of a male heir as the perfect opening to maneuver his daughter into the position of queen.
      Every office that Daemon was nominated for or appointed to Otto did his best to show how flawed he was for the position, taking advantage of the frought relationship between the brothers and moving him further from power. That also had the result if Viserys doubting his ability to be king.
      He also repeatedly downplayed what was happening in the Step Stones. He understood the problems it would ultimately cause Viserys, but at that point it was mostly only affecting Corlys whom he viewed as an obstacle to his own influence on Viserys and could propose a more advantageous marriage alliance. Encouraging Viserys to refuse to take action in that war was entirely self serving.
      Snitching on Rhaenyra was meant to cause strife and doubt about her fitness to rule as Queen. He is definitely using available chaos and creating some of hs own to get over.

    • PatrickFtw
      PatrickFtw 2 months ago

      He's not quite Littlefinger, but I'm not convinced he wouldn't create chaos for gain. He was willing to throw his young daughter at the King, despite knowing how anxious and scared she was about the whole ordeal, because he knew if they married that would strengthen his family. That's not quite Littlefinger levels of manipulation, but we've also only had 4 episodes, and he hasn't been put in many situations to prove otherwise yet. We will just have to wait and see, but I'd be very surprised if he doesn't have several things up his sleeve in future episodes

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago

      @Syn Thetic I think the difference is that if a prince is promiscuous, then the crown can just pretend the bastards never happened and let them live in poverty. But if a princess is promiscuous, what are they going to do with the bastard? They can't easily hide it. Every Lord is going to think "If she can get pregnant out of wedlock, then what's to stop her getting pregnant before her wedding and passing off the bastard as the husband's child?" They didn't have DNA tests back then, which is why this whole obsession with virginity of women started.

    • Wveth
      Wveth 2 months ago

      "Pretending Otto didnt scheme by causing chaos is inaccurate." Pretending that Daniel said that is also inaccurate. He didn't. He said Otto would rather the realm thrive and he does not want to create chaos for his own gain. Both of these things are true, you jumped the gun and misunderstood what he said lol. Otto did cause a bit of chaos, yes, although you are again pretending, this time that Otto is omniscient and knows for 100% certain the Laena Velaryon is the politically correct choice, which he doesn't because he isn't omniscient. Also his brother is pressuring him, also he probably thinks strengthening Old Town and the maesters IS good for the realm.

    • Skywatcher Adept
      Skywatcher Adept 2 months ago

      Otto might be serving Old Town above his own self-interest. His scheming is serving the Maesters vision o the world.
      Otto/Hobert Hightower & the Maesters might think their goals are ultimately serving the realm but their actions will lead almost to the downfall of Westeros.

  • Alexander James Nichols
    Alexander James Nichols 2 months ago +57

    This episode was way better than the last one. I find the intrigue so interesting

  • Sean Jones
    Sean Jones 2 months ago +17

    Some interesting things I noticed which weren’t discussed I don’t think…
    1) you mentioned that the moon tea can be brewed improperly which can cause harm to the reproductive system. Is it possible the maester INTENTIONALLY brewed it improperly? If they could render Rhenyra infertile, they can guarantee that Aegon II would become king.
    2) in episode 1, when the maesters we’re dealing with the King’s back wound caused by the throne, it’s interesting that the maesters kind of said “there’s nothing more we can do” UNTIL the little intern helper suggested cauterizing the wound, and only then did they agree that’s what they should do. I wonder has the kid not spoken, would the maesters just try to act like they tried everything and in the hope he could die from the wound? I forget if that scene was before or after the birth of Baelon, but if it was before, perhaps the maesters thought the birth would be successful and by killing the king, Otto could rule as hand and shape the future of westeros while the child came of age…

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago +3

      Spoilers from the book.....
      Rhanerya eventually has even more kids than Alicent, so I don't think the moon tea did anything negative to her reproductive tract. The only time she miscarrages is when Aegon II claims the throne, and that could be due to the stress, not anything wrong with her reproductive tract.

  • Haveldorf
    Haveldorf 2 months ago +50

    This episode was fucking incredible, it captured the tone of the books better than almost anything from GOT.

    • Haveldorf
      Haveldorf 2 months ago

      @Greywolf757 nah, that's an L take. "Awww poor sad boy doesn't know that no means no."
      He assaulted her next to her dead son's body AFTER saving Brienne from r*pe in an earlier episode.
      Fuck the showrunners, editors and directors for making that ridiculous choice, it completely assassinated Jamie's character and is massively damaging in the wider social sphere.
      What was the message or the point of that scene? Jamie never has any negative repercussions afterwards and it is never mentioned again.

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago

      @Haveldorf I think that scene fit the context, though. Jaime had a long history of having sex with Cersei. He was in an emotional moment and needed the comfort of that sex again. So he forced Cersei to have sex with him because he viewed her "no" as less sincere since she had said yes so many times before. Yes, it's wrong and twisted, but I think it is believable that a man with trauma would do something like that.

    • Haveldorf
      Haveldorf 2 months ago

      @Twiss do you know what i'm saying? They give Jamie this massive redemption arc where he has that crushing scene in the bath with Brienne and then saves her... just for him to assault Cersei and have no recompense for it.

    • Twiss
      Twiss 2 months ago +1

      @Haveldorf Jaime assaulting Cersei? Are you referring to the scene in the Sept near Joffrey body? Because if so, I had no idea that wasn’t in the books! What a strange thing to add 😂 of all the things

    • Haveldorf
      Haveldorf 2 months ago

      @xarmanhs h If they keep up this level of quality it will easily surpass the heights of Game of Thrones. (Season 1-4)
      Hopefully they don't make any big fuck ups or stupid decisions like Jamie assaulting Cersei. (I will never forgive them for that)

  • Chenara Seepersad
    Chenara Seepersad 2 months ago +20

    I really loved the “why couldn’t they send hot people” comment like for real if they all looked like daemon or criston she might have been more open to it

  • Tate Sherman
    Tate Sherman 2 months ago +14

    The scene where we are close up on Otto’s face was the most powerful for me. Really impressed and pleased with all the performances.

  • jklau544
    jklau544 2 months ago +74

    God I hope they make a Blackfyre Rebellion series after HoTD

    • jklau544
      jklau544 2 months ago

      @Greywolf757 to me it would make sense to go chronologically, if the Dunk and Egg series is definitely greenlit that’s awesome.

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago

      Which Blackfyre Rebellion? There were five of them. One of them would overlap Dunk and Egg, so if they did it for the Blackfyre TV show, they couldn't do it for the future Dunk and Egg TV show.

    • Christian Smith
      Christian Smith 2 months ago +4

      @Davey Jones Locker I'd love to see Robert in his prime. The fight with rhaegar

    • Davey Jones Locker
      Davey Jones Locker 2 months ago +5

      Production wise it would be the easiest for them to transition into, and it would be the most satisfying story investment for the fans. Hell after that we could even move right up to Robert’s Rebellion

    • Christian Smith
      Christian Smith 2 months ago +2

      I really hope they do that next since this show is already so successful. I'd also like to see an aegons conquest show as well but not as much as the black fire rebellion

  • Faith Esther
    Faith Esther 2 months ago +13

    The distressing scene here was when Alicent was tired and ready to go to sleep then Viserys called for her smh.

  • Aaron
    Aaron 2 months ago +71

    I don't think Mysaria betrayed Daemon I think that he had hear help him pay off the kid to snitch him and Rhaenyra out it makes sense he brought them out in public and took their disguises off but that doesn't insure that word gets out to the king I think he planned it all so that everyone would know that they fucked and her only choice would be to marry him strengthening both their claims but I think he and her shared a passionate moment and he felt bad for manipulating her and trapping her and he couldn't go through with it. That's why he didn't defend himself to the king and instead just asks his brother if he could marry her. That makes the most sense idk why at the end of the episode narrative they said that he got mad cause he couldn't get it up and felt like he was loosing control? It might be the case that he was in fact impotent because he felt awful about what he was about to do ruining one of the few people he truly loves innocence and name especially when he saw the love reciprocated.

    • melina dina
      melina dina 2 months ago +6

      They also said that he noticed that what he was doing wasn’t right 😂
      And then they said that he didn’t like that he was not in control
      It’s one thing before another (he obviously cares about her aaaand realized that he felt bad for manipulating her - aaand he noticed that she wants him, and it’s not right that they almost did it in a brothel, lol)

  • BattyButtercup
    BattyButtercup 2 months ago +107

    Daemon unhooding Rhaenerya before entering that brothel combined with Mysaria's informing Otto of a Daemon/Rhaenyra hookup? That suggests to me that both of them were being Political in this episode, setting the stage for Daemon to claim the throne... through marrying Rhaenyra.
    I do wonder whether Daemon knew of Mysaria's moves, this episode, and whether he'd feel embittered at her methods - he got exiled, AGAIN, he might be angered at throwing scrutiny so directly at Rhaenyra - but, by linking Rhaenyra sexually with Daemon, Mysaria has established Precedent for a marriage between them: this kind of scandal isn't the kind that gets forgotten.
    Daemon might have only intended to get his neice interested in making him her consort but Mysaria ensured that Rhaenyra's OWN claim became jeopardized: her reputation and several relationships have been soured, undoubtedly, whilst Daemon gets away with a slap on the wrist and getting remembered by Rhaenyra as her "fun" uncle.
    Daemon wants that Spiky Chair and since Viserys denied him any claim, Rhaenyra is Daemon's "in": Mysaria doesn't seem to mind whether Daemon gets there as a King in his own right... or as Rhaenyra's consort.
    (Yes, there is a "connection" between Daemon & Rhaenyra: he's still been grooming her toward such a relationship from the very first episode & very plausibly BEFORE then, too)

    • Rhianna Hayabusa
      Rhianna Hayabusa 2 months ago

      If that were the case, why would Daemon show her the life of commonfolk ? How people there think of them ?
      He even said to Rhaenyra that she's going to need her people on her side if she wants to rule implying he wants HER to rule. He showed her a very valuable lesson. Daemon is the only one out of Viserys, Rhaenyra that actually care about the commonfolk. And I think Daemon doesn't really want the throne, he just wants his lineage to sit on it while he stands by them. This is why Daemon is upset with his brother, he wanted to be Hand of the King. We will see that part confirmed soon enough. I genuinely think Daemon loves Rhaenyra and vice versa. Was he scheming as well ? I suppose. But in 1 night he showed her some valuable lessons (the importance of commonfolk, the importance of being your own person, the importance of taking charge of your own life, your own desires, doing what makes you happy). Let's not act like Rhaenyra was forced to kiss Daemon. If he didn't back away she would have fucked him.

    • BattyButtercup
      BattyButtercup 2 months ago +1

      @SummerIsComing that makes it even more interesting, that Mysaria's scheming towards the same goal as Daemon but in SPITE of him. it makes me wonder what other things she'll do, independently of Daemon, to ensure he has power beyond the death of Viserys.

    • SummerIsComing
      SummerIsComing 2 months ago +5

      But Daemon didn't know about Mysaria being the White Worm. I watched that scene again. He thinks she still does her previous work, and she tells him she learnt that skin selling isn't going to help her survive longer. Good chance he didn't know about her being a gossip girl

    • Fietspompje
      Fietspompje 2 months ago +1

      @M K its just a meme dude

    • M K
      M K 2 months ago

      ​@Fietspompje K

  • Traf Ridrod
    Traf Ridrod 2 months ago +47

    You got a comment asking if you thought Ser Criston was really willing or was pressured into getting into hanky panky with Rhaenyra. I think its possible that you misunderstood the question (or I did) because you said that, due to his kingsguard vows, he shouldn't have, even if she was commanding it. But my understanding of the question is was he willing. As in, did he want to. Was he consenting of his own volition, or just because she was in a position of power over him. The very last episode he straight up told her that the only reason he has the station in life that he does, is because of her. She holds all power over him, and even if he he told his commander "Well I vowed to be chaste" all she has to do is say, "He assaulted me". Not hard to decide which of the two someone would believe.
    At no point does Ser Criston give consent, he resists a couple times and then goes along, but obviously seems uncomfortable. It's possible he is crushing on her, and he's been having his own steamy dreams about this, but as you pointed out earlier in the stream, it seems he knows what he did is not good, but he was put in a position where either decision he made was going to turn out poorly for him. If he did in fact spurn Rhaenyra he could be out of the castle, or even worse could get a haircut at the neck.

  • Smythe283
    Smythe283 2 months ago +30

    Man, I almost wish that Jon stabbed Dany with the valerian dagger, rather than some random shank.
    If they were thinking about this at the same time as thrones was wrapping up, that could have been an actual interesting twist… it wouldn’t have made it any worse, but I think it could have made these scenes with the knife more interesting looking forwards.

  • Ben Somes
    Ben Somes 2 months ago +35

    Never would I have though Matt Smith would be good at dirty talk - actually subverting expectations 🔥👌

  • POEN POTZU
    POEN POTZU 2 months ago +167

    It's interesting how the sex scenes show that the gender roles and systemic issues allows these problematic behaviors to occur. Viserys martial rape with Alicent, Daemon grooming Rhaenyra, and Rhaenyra coercing Cole.

    • Twiss
      Twiss 2 months ago +2

      @Greywolf757 I agree. But it’s also super presumptuous to say that it wasn’t rape. If my view point is so negotiable, then yours is just as much. It’s a testament to the scene. Because many of these situations IRL are just as nuanced.

    • Twiss
      Twiss 2 months ago +2

      @Ruxandra Avram exactly.

    • Ruxandra Avram
      Ruxandra Avram 2 months ago

      Gender roles?
      Yeah, Rhaenyra is a woman in a medieval society, but...
      She is in a position of power and coerces Criston into doing the deed, he verbalises it, he said "stop!". But she insists.
      She is his boss.
      And people say: "oh, that's empowering, she took control over her sexuality, blah, blah"
      No, that's not empowering, that's just gross.
      If the gender swap makes you want to vomit, it's not empowering.

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago

      @Twiss Alicent may not have enjoyed the sex, but that isn't the same thing as it being non-consensual. Maybe she wants more children. Maybe she feels a duty to produce more children as much as Viserys does. Maybe she just wants her husband to be happy.
      Deciding whether it is rape or not means asking "Would Alicent have done this if she was living in an equal relationship with Viserys?" It isn't easy to answer that question, so it isn't easy to pin it as rape or not.

    • Twiss
      Twiss 2 months ago

      @Ethan Staaf have you been watching? It not being the woman’s place to say anything is an obvious theme of the show. Characters aren’t as simple as being either black or white. You’ll find most people are gray. I think you’re leaning too heavily into whatever perception you have of the king. This is the same dude who killed his wife even after she kept voicing her health concerns. I’m sure after many years of their marriage, his wife and him would have had enough rapport where they had the conversation many times. Did that change the kings attitude though? Him not caring if Alicent is into it and continuing to pump away at her limp body with no passion whatsoever is not so inconceivable

  • Mundane Glassworks
    Mundane Glassworks 2 months ago +9

    Loved the foreshadowing of her possible future hinted at by the Old Fortune Teller when She's wandering the streets of Kings Landing with Daemon.

  • Isabella DeLoach
    Isabella DeLoach 2 months ago +11

    Question: I'm noticing some very... um... spicy tapestries all over the Red Keep. Is there a reason for this? I Don't think I remember them from the main series - and like it totally tracks that after a couple hundred years they would have switched up the decor- but it almost would have made more sense for those to be around under Robert Baratheon. King Viserys doesn't really strike me as a "put spicy tapestries up all over" type of guy.

    • Rubén N. Martín
      Rubén N. Martín 2 months ago +1

      Hi! The tapestries show people having sex with some kind of dragon-humanoids.
      There are theories about the first inhabitants of Valyria, centuries ago, depicting them as dragon-people.
      They had relations/contact/sex with the first humans and that's why some houses of Valyria had that "dragon blood" and control over dragons.
      It may be true or not, but is very cool :)

    • Robyn Hyden
      Robyn Hyden 2 months ago +6

      I think this episode, and previous interactions between Allicent and Rhaenerya, show that Targaryens are much less concerned with sexual morality and don’t care about the faith of the seven. So they brought less sexual restraints with them stemming from their eastern culture and traditions. Allicent is scandalized by the idea that Rhaenerya had sex, but Viserys doesn’t much seem concerned about it other than the fact that Daemon was the one behind it. So the dirty tapestries (and incest) track with them flouting social norms, being above everyone else and not caring. The first thing Robert Baratheon would do would be to tear down all the signs and sigils of the Targs.

  • Shubert Reads
    Shubert Reads 2 months ago +123

    Another nice, calm, civilized discussion in the livechat 😅

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago +1

      @Dave Dogge A lot of it was people adding "-ussy" to the end of female character's names.

    • Gadget-Walkmen
      Gadget-Walkmen 2 months ago +1

      @Alan's Saladbar uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh no. Just no. I’m not “complaining” over nothing, I’m stating WHAT happens in live streams constantly and why people should avoid them to the OP comment because of their unreasonable insufferable behavior.

    • Alan's Saladbar
      Alan's Saladbar 2 months ago

      @Gadget-Walkmen Like how you're complaining about other people complaining?

    • Dr Phils Ranch
      Dr Phils Ranch 2 months ago +1

      For whatever reason people just become lobotomized zombies when they tune into a livestream, whether it’s on twitch or X-vid.

    • Chris
      Chris 2 months ago +1

      😂😂😂😂

  • magister343
    magister343 2 months ago +20

    My big problem with this episode is that a lot of scenes looked like D&D were in charge of the lighting.

  • Wealth Wolf
    Wealth Wolf 2 months ago +57

    With family so I unfortunately missed the stream. Episode is an automatic 10/10 imo solely for including Blackwood’s and Bracken’s.

    • Щербина
      Щербина 2 months ago +3

      You should watch it with your family

    • d11ng
      d11ng 2 months ago +9

      payoff to future blackfyre rebellions 👌🏻👌🏻

  • Silvia Sánchez
    Silvia Sánchez 2 months ago +7

    I took it as Daemon teasing her enough to make her desire for more and make her look bad in front of others; knowing that word would spread eventually about her in the brothel and that would leave him as only possible candidate to marry her regardless if she was still a maiden or not. I thought it was calculated, that's what I'm saying.

  • Nick Hoppers
    Nick Hoppers 2 months ago +20

    I thoroughly enjoy these livestreams and enjoy them for your analysis of the show and I thank you for doing it. I understand why you want content that is book spoiler free for the majority of fans that are more casual. But I’m having a hard time finding content that talks about book spoilers in conjunction with the show as it’s released. Your core fan base that watched all your videos in the years between the end of GoT and now and we are the ones that will stick around during content droughts, and I’m sure I’m not the only fan of yours that would like to hear your analysis with book spoilers included in a separate live stream or video. Regardless of you doing it or not, I thank you for all the work you put out and will continue to support you and your content

    • Angel Van Dam
      Angel Van Dam 2 months ago +1

      @TheChris2RC I'm the exact opposite of you haha. I'm a show watcher who has never read (and will probably never read) the books... And I LOVE the comparitive breakdowns - spoilers and all. I definitely want to find a channel that goes deep into the book lore and history ALONG WITH the show episode by episode - but that's just how I like to consume my content :P
      Just saying this to point out there are you's and there are me's :) we both exist!

    • TheChris2RC
      TheChris2RC 2 months ago +1

      @Yellow House me! I stopped watching Hello Future Me's covarage because of bookspoilers showing up in his analysis

    • Yellow House
      Yellow House 2 months ago +1

      Yeah like how many casual fans would sit through a 3 hour live stream for just one episode?

  • Notribad's vault
    Notribad's vault 2 months ago +19

    The problem with the idea that Daemon didn’t say “heir for a day” is that Otto has yet to actually directly lie to Viserys. Plus I just think the idea is really stupid considering he didn’t even try to deny it, and I don’t buy for a second that he would put up with Otto manipulating Viserys against him so brazenly.

    • Notribad's vault
      Notribad's vault 2 months ago

      @Wveth That’s what I kinda think too, Daemon is an asshole but he’s not 100% a dick. And I think the way he responded kinda supports that.

    • Wveth
      Wveth 2 months ago +3

      He probably did say it, just not in the tone Otto implied. Also, in this episode he DEFINITELY could have defended himself by saying he didn't have sex with Rhaenyra, which is technically true. So he doesn't always defend himself when he can, which I imagine is because he's conflicted about his actions.

  • itskashkashi
    itskashkashi 2 months ago +11

    I think the question is if cole could really consent with the power imbalance between them.

  • ImnotAljeff
    ImnotAljeff 2 months ago +21

    I think there's a possibility that Alicent was mad because she might be starting to see Rhaenyra as a daughter and her fury was caused by worry that Rhaenyra may be making the same mistake that she did. (If the theory about Viserys and Alicent sleeping with each other the night before their engagement is true).
    Another reason why I think this could be the case, is the direction of the scene; Alicent starts off in a higher position and is looking down while talking to her, she walks closer to her while maintaining her distance, up until Rhaenyra calls her sister at which point she moves closer to Alicent and they start to talk at eye level, which forces Alicent to be at equal footing with Rhaenyra.

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago

      I don't think Alicent had sex with Viserys before marriage. But I do think that Alicent thinks of Rhaenyra like a daughter and like a former best friend, so she doesn't want Rhaenray to throw away her good reputation. Alicent knows it could cost Rhaenyra the crown and Alicent hasn't yet come around to supporting her son for the throne.

    • Amartya Mukherjee
      Amartya Mukherjee 2 months ago +1

      I noted their, almost symbolic, movements in front of the weirwood tree as well, kind of mirroring the dynamics of their "moral standpoint".

  • Veera
    Veera 2 months ago +32

    I interpreted the interaction between Lady Misery, Daemon, and Otto as such:
    Daemon came to Kings Landing for a reason other than the brotherly-bond. He wants to be closer to the throne and knows the best way there is through a marriage with his niece. By taking her “virtue” and making her “undesirable”, Daemon stands (politically) to be the only possible suitor left for his niece to marry.
    Lady Misery is loyal to Daemon.
    With that in mind, the entire “scandal” seemed orchestrated by Daemon - to be witnessed by a spy for Lady Misery - to then be sold to Otto Hightower - who would then undoubtedly use that information to his benefit by putting King Viserys in a position where Rhaenyra’s entitlement of the throne would then come into question.
    Daemon’s inability to “finish what he started”, and sudden frustration likely stemmed from the fact that he does like his niece, and using/corrupting her to get what he wants wasn’t a morally satisfying outcome - hence why he then proceed to get blackout drunk and pass out face-first in the dirt immediately afterwards.
    I could be way off here (haven’t read the book), but to me - this looked to be a calculated play by Daemon and Lady Misery, as ultimately he’s the one that potentially benefits the most from it.
    What has he lost? Nothing. He was banished before he came to kings landing, and is banished again - ultimately at no real cost.
    What has he gained? Otto was fired. There’s now the threat of a rumor that may ruin Rhaenyra’s ability to find an outside suitor. Rhaenyra clearly likes him, and happens to be the heir to the throne. Her children (Daemon’s children) would then inherit the throne.
    We’ll have to see, but the discussions around this scene in particular have sparked some interesting conversations.

    • Ousman Jallow
      Ousman Jallow 2 months ago

      Yep

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago

      I think you've got the correct understanding of Daemon's plan. Even though he failed to get Rhaenyra's hand in marriage, he still got Otto fired and got Rhaenyra interested in him sexually, with his punishment being no different from the punishment he'd already been given. He's playing the long game.

    • Mo
      Mo 2 months ago

      @We're the reckless, we're the wild youth Guy said he didn't read the book, why the fuck do you feel the need to spoil?
      Keep your book reading to yourself.

  • Rachel W
    Rachel W 2 months ago +56

    I really hope Emma has as much chemistry with Matt as Milly does! You can tell Daemon and Rhaenyra really want each other

    • Ousman Jallow
      Ousman Jallow 2 months ago

      It’s not that deep🤣💀

    • noor
      noor 2 months ago +4

      Man...

    • Pramod Bisht
      Pramod Bisht 2 months ago +1

      I hope they marry i want to see them together.

    • tempodude
      tempodude 2 months ago +4

      daemon groomed her from their first scene together, what he did this episode was nothing more than a political play for him, and he made sure she was drunk and isolated. it's not chemistry it's an abuse of a power dynamic, even if she didn't flinch or whatever.

    • dubudan
      dubudan 2 months ago +6

      bro

  • Adam Brown
    Adam Brown 2 months ago +140

    It looks like the cuts Viserys has received from the Iron Throne has given him Necrotizing Fasciitis (flesh eating disease). All the symptoms make sense except for how slowly it progresses. Just a thought!

    • Onyx DragonBorn
      Onyx DragonBorn 2 months ago +2

      @Gonx it's never lupus 😆

    • Moonman
      Moonman 2 months ago

      @Morteih Morteih stop, I don’t wanna vomit 🤢

    • Ola W
      Ola W 2 months ago +8

      We thought that Drogon in S8 wanted to melt the throne but he maybe just wanted to disinfect this yucky chair

    • TobeWilsonNetwork
      TobeWilsonNetwork 2 months ago

      @C H. that would make sense, we know he’s an alcoholic

    • Gonx
      Gonx 2 months ago +2

      No, its lupus, trust me.

  • DoMw4r
    DoMw4r 2 months ago +30

    "Kingdoms rise and fall based on who dicks who"
    -- Alt-Shift-X, 2022

  • User 1
    User 1 2 months ago +36

    I think Otto is gonna give Alicent a "you have to save the world" speech before he leaves.

    • Gus
      Gus 2 months ago +2

      Given Rhaenyra's behavior, Alicent might get on board with her father's line of thinking fairly soon

    • Faith Esther
      Faith Esther 2 months ago +1

      Same thought

  • TwobitRules
    TwobitRules 2 months ago +12

    In the Inside the Episode this week, Rhaenyra’s actress pointed out that she didn’t *technically* lie to Alicent about having sex with Daemon, she only told Alicent that Daemon “didn’t touch her,” which I’m not sure if that was meant to merely imply to her that it was consensual lollygagging or that there was no sexual interaction between them at all, which sort of leaves Rhaenyra’s statement to Alicent even more complicated for me

    • Skywatcher Adept
      Skywatcher Adept 2 months ago

      Rhaenyra tried to pull a Bill Clinton testimony trick in denying what happened between her & Daemon.

  • Ramiel Lilith
    Ramiel Lilith 2 months ago +6

    I'ma keep it a buck. The King is really killing this role (everyone) The passion is definitely there.

  • Sayaalicious !!
    Sayaalicious !! 2 months ago +5

    Alicent and Rhaenyra’s friendship breakup will be my villain origin story

  • Kampi
    Kampi 2 months ago

    Really my favourite episode until now, it's all coming together so beautifully well, and the artistry behind the show as well as the acting is really quite incredible
    Casting is top notch, having read the book I can't believe this show surpassed my expectations this much, didn't believe I'd get so into it and that they'd really manage to create these storylines in a way that absolutely works and makes sense with the hints we get in the history
    Can't wait for more

  • Jerald Jackson
    Jerald Jackson 2 months ago +3

    I think he should've waited to have the valeryons loyalty again before getting rid of Otto. It could end up being that he faces multiple enemies now because while he may have made the proper choice getting rid of Otto I do believe it was ill timed

  • Rachel McDonald
    Rachel McDonald 2 months ago +44

    I thought Rhaenyra just backtracked to Balerions skull room then went back to her room the way she usually does from there. Since they specially showed her realizing the passage lead through there.

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago

      Yeah, maybe she went back in the secret entrance and then got lost and came out somewhere else inside the Red Keep and just walked back to her room from there.

    • firemochimc
      firemochimc 2 months ago +2

      In the books those passages are insanely convoluted and long.
      It's reasonable for her not going back that way.

    • Twiss
      Twiss 2 months ago +2

      LOL yeah I was a bit ??? about that

  • Justin Grey
    Justin Grey 2 months ago +2

    I think the question concerning consent was about whether Cole actually consented (or whether he even could), or felt like he had no choice but to sleep with her. I don't think there was any question that she initiated, he was very passive in her removing his armor. The sequence seems mirrored by Alicent doing what the King expects of her at about the same time. I think it certainly seemed like Cole was more than a bit uncomfortable, and I think that's what the question was referring to.
    Considering the power disparity between them, that he at least on one occasion brought up that he owes all that he is and has achieved to her, the question of whether his consent was somewhat coerced seems like it's still on the table. She didn't need to say "sleep with me or I'll destroy your life" for him to worry that he's damned in either case.

  • Lara Cuevas
    Lara Cuevas 2 months ago +3

    The existence of your videos and live discussions makes my experience with this show so much better, thank you very much! Greetings from Argentina :)

  • Narrative Jones
    Narrative Jones 2 months ago +38

    Am i the only one who finds Rhaenyra to be one of the less smpathetic characters in the story so far?

    • Taytay Queen
      Taytay Queen 2 months ago +2

      @Ruxandra Avram I am team entertainment. This is a tv show. 😂 I want to see all the messed up things so I get entertained

    • Ruxandra Avram
      Ruxandra Avram 2 months ago +1

      @Taytay Queen
      How about being #teamsmallfolk?

    • Queen B
      Queen B 2 months ago +1

      @Nightman EXACTLY - both Daemon and Rhaenyra believe you can do whatever you want and your word is law (as I'm re-watching Game of Thrones, Viserys says to Dany that he is King and can do whatever he wants) what a fatal flaw the Targaryens have. So many people are blind to it and I'm like ???

    • Taytay Queen
      Taytay Queen 2 months ago +5

      @Madelyn Morgan I’ve realised it depends on what you value more as a person. If you as a person value duty and honour more, you will be team green. If you value rebellion and independence, you are more likely to be team black. I’ve seen this amongst people I’ve asked.

    • Madelyn Morgan
      Madelyn Morgan 2 months ago +8

      same! i feel like the greens are much more sympathetic at this point

  • WOAHseph
    WOAHseph 2 months ago +2

    Rhaenyra's characterisation is inconsistent to me. Episode 3 made a big deal about how she is compassionate to innocent creatures and refuses unnecessary violence, and then in this episode a little boy is about to fight to the death right in front of her and she... walks away and doesn't give a shit? She could've easily broken that up.

  • D. M. Collins
    D. M. Collins 2 months ago +7

    This show TOTALLY switched me from being Team Alicent to being Team Rhaenyra. Which speaks SO HIGHLY of the show. Especially when you consider that Alicent, at least on paper, has been a much more sympathetic character than Rhaenyra in the TV series. And yet there's something about Rhaenyra's rebelliousness that just feels more deserving of praise.

    • P G
      P G 2 months ago

      Her rebelliousness is essentially just selfishness and irresponsibility. She could use some of Alicents sense of duty and diplomacy if she wants to be a good queen that is loved and respected by her subjects.

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago +1

      I think if Alicent got as much screen time as Rhaenyra does, then people might feel differently.
      I just go by the fact that in most Medieval societies, the first born son is the heir, regardless of whether he has an older sister. So the easy answer is that Aegon II is the heir.

    • Konrad von Schnitzeldorf
      Konrad von Schnitzeldorf 2 months ago +2

      Rhaenyra is clearly the protagonist in the show, so it's not that surprising

  • daroe23
    daroe23 2 months ago +19

    Otto Got so overconfident in his ability to manipulate the weaknesses of Viserys that he way overstepped his situation here, which was completely evident when the Viserys’ first response to hearing “your daughter was in a brothel” was to say “so fucking what?”

    • Cancerino
      Cancerino 2 months ago

      Yeah... But he wasn't manipulating him here. He clearly didn't even want to tell him.

    • Echo
      Echo 2 months ago +17

      It was so refreshing that Viserys finally got his head out of his ass and understood that Otto has been manipulating him from the get-go. The real question is, what is going to happen to Alicent now that Viserys understands that Otto manipulated her into being what Viserys needed at the exact time that he needed it?

  • Angel Melendez
    Angel Melendez 2 months ago +3

    My initial thoughts on the spy is Daemon knew exactly what was going to happen , that is why he took the princess out . The whole thing was planned including whiteworm and Daemon. She even said " I am the only one Protecting you " as she collected the money . He knew Otto would tell the King . Daemon did not act surprised when he was grabbed . My feeling is he knew this was going to happen and his brother would not harm him . Banishment ? He knows that means nothing to him . Now did he know the King was going to throw out Otto ? I doubt it , but the timing of the princess drawing a line with Otto , makes you wonder . But i digress . I dont think white worm was setting Daemon up , I think it was Daemon who put her up to it

  • Rebecca Rivers
    Rebecca Rivers 2 months ago +1

    In my own headcannon, "Light Bringer" was the first "Valyrian" Steel Sword. Forging Valyrian steel swords requires the sacrifice the blacksmith's love. Therefore every Valyrian steel sword is "Light Bringer". It would explain why Valyrian steel is so rare. It takes a very big sacrifice to make. Helmet and Armor made of Valyrian steel it could have been tempered by the blacksmith's love wearing it to temper it rather than being stabbed.

  • SilverScale
    SilverScale 2 months ago +3

    I'm sorry but I don't give a sh*t about Alicent potentially feeling betrayed if she finds out Rhaenyra lied to her about the brothel thing. Rhaenyra HAD to lie, for self-protection (similar to how she killed the boar last episode in self-defense), whereas Alicent spent 6 months secretly seducing Rhae's father and married him and had his babies that threaten Rhae's position (similar to the ignoble, undignified and weak way Viserys kills that hart) so, gtfo with that "betrayal" bit, lol!

  • Peter James
    Peter James 2 months ago +5

    Thanks for commentary. I thought Otto was hesitant from watching the actor's face but But the director made it clear this was 100% his agenda, to sully Rhaenyra's name. if he was hesitant it was more about overplaying his hand. The implication of the show was that his son Aegon from his first wife was actually killed by Otto in concert with the maesters, because the maester whispers to Otto before the whole birth falls to shit. The show also implies that Otto murdered his predecessor as hand. Viseris probably should have killed him outright. As far as the coin to Daemon's woman, the implication is that Miseria wanted to share the information and sold it to Otto, the coin was passed to the boy and then to Miseria.

  • Alex Whyte
    Alex Whyte 2 months ago +10

    I took Daemon strafing the boat on Caraxes as him flexing for Rhaenyra. Also kind of a dominance thing. It plays as a metaphor for how he treats her later on in the episode when he takes her out of her comfort zone in order to entice her

  • Tj Anderson
    Tj Anderson 2 months ago +5

    I think it’s more likely Maegor was an abomination created by witch queen Visenya. She was never able to get pregnant when she was younger but when she was fairly old and fluent in the potions and witch craft stuff she suddenly got pregnant and produced a perfect Targaryen and King in the physical sense. But mentally he was a bit deranged bc she skimped on those ingredients that she saw as weak. He likely saved the the Targaryen Dynasty too so maybe he was a necessary evil to Visenya who definitely killed his brother king Aneis. Maegor was probably infertile since birth due to how he was conceived. Whether thats an inadvertent consequence by Visenya or somethin she did on purpose well never know 🤷🏾‍♂️

  • Harley Quinn Lover
    Harley Quinn Lover 2 months ago +7

    I feel bad for Alicent and do think she is projecting her feelings onto Rhaeynera. I think Rhaeynera will become more rebellious and Alicent show more envy towards her over the years.

  • Branden Dierker
    Branden Dierker 2 months ago +23

    I think otto paid the boy for spying and then the boy gave the money to his true master

    • TC tha Crisis
      TC tha Crisis 2 months ago +1

      Varys... who we finally learn he's over 300 years old.

  • Jet G. Eighty-seven
    Jet G. Eighty-seven 2 months ago +36

    Rhaenyra was written so expertly in this episode!
    Avoiding talk, seeking validation, covering up and lashing out on the Hand... she was certainly a real person! The director of "How To Deal" did GOOD!

    • rezq
      rezq 2 months ago +6

      Yes. I like how some of her actions might seem unsympathetic for some vieweres, but they are LOGICAL. Love it.

  • C
    C 2 months ago +2

    47:00
    I think you misunderstood the question. This encounter isn't consensual for the knight. She holds power over him. And the way he's standing there while she's just laughing made it seem like she was taking advantage of him. Who is he to deny the princess what she wants? Any guy in that position doens't have much of a choice. We the audience can assume she wouldn't do anything to him, but he doesn't know that. His job as her guard could be lost. His family's name ruined.
    I doubt the writers of the show even considered it because it's so focused on how bad it is to be a woman. I have zero faith that they'd be nuanced enough to show she's imposing her power on not only a man, but a good man who doesn't deserve to be taken advantage of...
    Sucks to say it but...reverse their genders...The king calls for his wife who clearly doesn't want to have sex, but she has no choice. It's gross and creepy. Same with the princess and the knight. He tries to turn her down, but she keeps insisting. And saying no could ruin his life and house...so it's gross and terrifying.

  • whynotcaptaincrunch
    whynotcaptaincrunch 2 months ago +82

    The horrible sex scene between Alicent and Viserys made me think of Henry VIII. Later in his life he had this festering wound on his leg that would burst out in ulcers, and he must have been quite physically repulsive by the time he married Catherine Howard, who was 30 years younger than him. I think one of the neat things about this series is all the historical parallels.

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago +1

      Hey, Viserys can't control how he looks!

    • Pramod Bisht
      Pramod Bisht 2 months ago +1

      It wasn't horrible but bit sad yes.

  • Anke Jl
    Anke Jl 2 months ago +14

    Otto says to Viserys that some servants saw Rheanyra getting in at night, so I suppose thats how she got in. She would be more recognizable than Arya, who had only just arrived and wasn't the heir to the throne.

  • Jupiter
    Jupiter 2 months ago +2

    I find it interesting that Cole is getting blamed for the sex, instead of being seen as the victim because of the power dynamic. If roles were reversed and Cole was a Prince and Rhaynera had similar role to Cole, he would have been blamed for using his power to get sex.

  • Tyler Mcdonald
    Tyler Mcdonald 2 months ago +1

    I watched the season finale of GoT with you but as soon as I saw you were doing House of the dragon my ass knew I was in for some good content

  • mekalunia
    mekalunia 2 months ago +126

    Everyone hooking with everyone and then lying and backstabbing, this episode reminds me of a telenovela.

  • L3gion
    L3gion 2 months ago

    So happy we are able to live in this world again but I know heartbreak in ahead as we become attached to these amazing characters!

  • Matthew McClure
    Matthew McClure 2 months ago +1

    Great "level-headed" insights and balanced review of the episode. It led me to subscribe and I look forward to your future videos. I want to warn/apologize for my really long post. Perhaps it's hubris, but I perceive there's a critically important and ever-present element residing in the background of the GOT universe. I think it's not only intended to enhance the richness and depth of the GOT world, but it's also an intentional and not-so-subtle commentary on the real world. Perhaps there's some small potential for enriching the insight of viewers with enough fortitude to read and consider my thoughts.
    I think you're right about George's fascination with "forbidden love", but I think there's another equally strong motivation for the rampant vows of chastity. I don't deny a "virgin princess" is a valuable political asset. Nor am I arguing there isn't merit in eliminating distraction or internal-conflict, which could take focus away from an important responsibility. However, nothing in George's writing is that simple, nor are real-world issues this reductive. Keep in mind whether it's the Faith of the Seven or an unrelated Military Order, the rules are rooted in faith-based practices and morality, and their practical applications are designed for maintaining order and control.
    I can't speak for George, but there's likely an intended passive-aggressive jab at the manipulative nature of Christianity nested in GOT/HOTD. Along with any other religion that institutes arbitrary rules under the guise of piety... and then dresses them up as issues of morality/commitment. When overlaid in the context of defunct ancient faith systems, the unlikely survival of specific Bronze-Age religions is shockingly arbitrary, but it's no accident. The survival of one supernatural construct vs. another has nothing to do with merit/legitimacy or proven and accepted historicity. The persistence of these faiths is owed almost entirely to state-sponsorship from powerful authorities -> who correctly identified they provided a useful mechanism for controlling and manipulating the population towards their agenda. Especially faith systems that contained both a powerful carrot and stick (fear and reward are strong motivators). We see these same regionally based constructs in GOT/HOTD in the form of worship of the "Old Gods" vs. the "New Gods", and it's even more clear in GOT societies that attempt to maximize their reach by promoting both views.
    Situation-specific piety is one of the few oppressive "moral" elements in the GOT universe that extends beyond keeping women in a subservient role. While breaking a vow of chastity by soiling the princess magnifies the perception of the offense, the fact remains that Criston Cole (or Jon Snow) would face serious consequences for breaking his vow with a commoner too. It would take a lot more explanation to fully flush out my comment as it relates to real-world modern faiths, but I'm not going to write an essay in a X-vid post that's probably already too long and still isn't finished. Suffice to say the repeatedly negative manner in which the Faith of the Seven is presented is no accident, and potentially mirrors a perspective on actual world religions. For a writer like George who is obsessed with history, chipping away at our idealized perceptions of Medieval Chivalry is probably no accident either.
    Whether by choice or oppression, I think characters in GOT/HOTD are subject to influences so deeply embedded in their societies, that very view ever stop to consider how this impacts their decision making... just like we are today in the real-world. Sometimes it's portrayed subtly in GOT. At other times the impact of buying-in to the shame and unforgivable nature of violating standards an unbiased and detached observer would view as unfounded, is on full display. Criston's decision to commit suicide is a clear example. We just finished watching a scene when Criston presents the option to run away to a territory outside the 7 Kingdoms, where the King holds no sway. We don't know yet "how" Criston got out of the banquet hall without being arrested, but he did, and the option to flee is very much available. Instead he chooses the "honorable" path of taking his life as a consequence of violating multiple Westeros equivalents of "sins". Sure, the thought of living without Raina might seem unbearable at the moment, but very few people actually follow through with suicide to escape a broken heart. I perceive Criston's thought-process is almost entirely tied to his moral-conscience. In that moment, his freewill is imprisoned by an imaginary cage that's a direct result of his moral code, and that moral code is entirely formed as a result of a lifetime of social conditioning with faith-based origins.
    I've really tried to maintain a reasonable level of respect for people with different world views, but I want to wrap this post up as clearly as I can. As a Christian my thought-process was shielded by a mechanism that allowed me to disassociate the hypocritical, illogical, and harmful elements of my beliefs. I was oblivious of my hypocrisy when I negatively perceived the exact same flaws in other belief systems. I couldn't recognize the powerful nature of the perpetually reinforced social conditioning I received as a child/young adult and the extent it warped by views. I think GOT intentionally plants a seed in the form of an indirect social comment aimed directly at real-world religions. If you're actively committed to a faith, this might not be as clear to you as it is for an atheist/agnostic. If I've offended anyone, I apologize... you do you.

  • Sam F.S.
    Sam F.S. 2 months ago +2

    Certainly would like to see your end of the week analysis video, you'll have the chance to watch the episode multiple times and kinda didssect it better. Also, Mushroom did say Daemon took Rhaenyra to a brothel, he essentially had a more salacious version of the events in the episode. Also, loving the fact he didn't know Cris and Rhaen had seggs. Just shows that not everyone knew everything. The words Daemon had for Viserys are lifted straight from the book though, Eustace's account! So yeah, they each were observing the situation from a different angle (Tried to fill the gaps... Each their own way I guess). Love how Ryan and Miguel worked both accounts in. Eustace saw stuff from Visery's perspective, Mushroom from the Fleebottom scandalous gossip perspective.
    The truth was even beyond what both of them saw. That's good writing. Seriously, makes the entire book's accounts and events like R+L=J level deep situations... gotta be looked into and dissected.
    Not for people who can't see the forest through the trees.

  • tempodude
    tempodude 2 months ago +1

    My favorite moment this episode was the shot from daemon's pov while he's being dragged into the throne room.
    With great effort he looks up at the throne, but eventually resigns himself to watch the floor flying by, the most he can do in his drunken state. I got that he's thinking "So things are going to plan but now has come the part of the plan where I face the consequence for my actions, and even though this is good for me it's still gonna hurt like hell."
    Plus the shot is just beautiful and super unique.

  • CreeDo Lala
    CreeDo Lala 2 months ago +3

    I'm sure I'm not the only one to point this out, but I keep hearing "technically she didn't lie"... well if we're being technical, she said "he never touched me" which is undeniably a lie.
    Edit: oh, someone finally points it out after a couple hours. That'll teach me to jump the gun.

  • Whitest_Rabbit
    Whitest_Rabbit 2 months ago +1

    Every character seems to be growing and developing before our eyes, besides deamon. He feels like the same flat character we've been told to hate since ep.1 they need to give him more screen time so we can understand his thought process other than, he wants to be king.

  • gd1247
    gd1247 2 months ago +10

    I love the contrast between three sex scenes all showing dubious consent of varying degrees. Very good, grey character writing.

  • not lurking
    not lurking 2 months ago +8

    I definitely think that one part of Allicent's anger at Rhaynera is that she is so closely tied to The Faith, because on the face of it it's complete hypocrisy for her to be so mad when she's like the same age and has had 2 kids. I think that it makes sense for her to draw her morals from the faith. But that also may be my book knowledge about the faith bleeding into a show that won't really touch on Allicent's association to it so 🤷🏻

    • Greywolf757
      Greywolf757 2 months ago

      If you've met any religious people, you know that they love sex so long as it is in marriage (and missionary style only).

  • deepeye1328
    deepeye1328 2 months ago +2

    Each HOT D episode becomes better and better, more intriguing, but something really bad has to happen closer to the end to climax the show. For a person who never read the books - it's extremely interesting to see what happens next.
    Acting is fantastic. I would say that the whole show is a BIG step up from GoT on all levels. I would not even think to compare to another show right now, you know what it. Absolutely different levels of substance.
    Thank you so much for all the comparison with the books and additional details/thoughts and dodging all spoilers so well! Much appreciated!